UK. It comes from Mark Bradley's article in which he calls for an end
to Felton's tenure.
It's hard to argue with Woody's comment given how well the team played
during the Tourney in terms of tempo, aggression and general
competence vs now.
Right now this team is a total mess. They have fewer field goals than
turnovers in the past two games.
The questions in my mind are:
1. would a mid-season termination hurt us in our search for a
replacement for Felton?
2. Would a mid-season firing do anything more than put us and him out
of our collective misery?
3. Doesn't an SEC Tourney title count for something? No matter how
absurd the tourney was it is still a title. Doesn't that buy him more
than half 3 SEC games?
4. I'm not interested in any of the assistants as replacements long
term so what's the point of giving them a chance?
5. What will it "fix?" Now?
The best reason to remove him would be if you thought the existing
players would play better with Hermann or Jones as head coach.
I can't defend where we are and no one else can either. Not with a
straight face. It's bad and it's inexcusably bad for year 6.
The dates to watch for a possible mid-season termination are next
Monday if we lose to MSU, Feb 12 after the 4 of 5 road game swing, and
March 8 after the last regular season game.
The real issue isn't who coaches next week. The issue is who coaches
next season?
Can he save his job? Sure....if he can deliver 2 months of what we got
in the McThriller Dome. Tallest of orders. It will be interesting to
see what David Ching says on this topic.
Pwd
*no links tonight and likely lots of typos. I'm writing this while
looking at a 1 inch by 1 inch mobile device window.
Check Bradley and Ching for commentary.
38 comments:
PWD, all your arguments against in-season firing are rational and appropriate. I have never supported an in-season firing, but I am getting close to my first; I think the reason you have not included is that a radical move in response to such abject failure would send a message that this is unacceptable and will not be tolerated. And everyone would hear it, including the players.
As I mentioned in my other post on the Vandy thread, the sight of an Atlanta native starring for an out-of-state conference competitor who brings as many fans to our gym as we do, then whips our pathetic arses with vastly less effort than the latest VMI/Longwood/Florida Atlantic they've played, is too thoroughly sickening to watch or than to think anything is happening other than complete implosion.
I wonder how bad the athletic department will let it get, though I do admire their principled approach to coaches.
I generally think it's tacky to fire a coach mid-season, especially one we've stuck with this long. BUT at the same time, things aren't progressing and it's hard to argue DF isn't in complete Dead Coach Walking, lame duck status. Might be time to acknowledge the elephant in the room, relieve him of his duties, and let both parties move on to their next opportunity.
To answer your questions:
1. Any replacement would see that we gave the man 5+ years... hardly the short leash some places give, even considering the problems he inherited.
2. Even if that was it, that's enough! Plus it gives us a head-start on hiring the next guy: We can't make moves while DF is still "head coach" in name.
3. An SEC regular season title would count for something, or a decent NCAA showing. But I honestly don't think the SEC tournament should count for anything beyond the fact that he didn't get canned last year (when he probably should have). It was an amazing thing, sure, but mainly because we've been so dreadful under Felton. A week of solid play does not outweigh years of not even sniffing mediocrity.
4. I'm not interested in any of the assistants either, but put it this way: Do they have any LESS chance of being HC next year than Felton? Maybe it sparks a resurgence, Dabo at Clemson style (though hopefully not followed up by a permanent hiring).
5. What will it "fix?" now? I don't know, but it can't get much worse, can it? Is it worse for recruiting to have a lame duck coach or no coach? I don't know but at least with the latter, you know what you're getting -- it can't be comfortable for either side of the table when Felton tells a prospect he's here for the long haul.
Again, I'm against mid-season coaching moves in general, but desperate times... The program is a disaster and maybe it needs to be blown up sooner rather than later.
Felton needs to be fired monday. This program is dead. One lucky run in the SEC tourny doesnt change 6 crappy years.
Ching is extremely fair.
David Hale has quotes directly from Felton, Wood, and Trey.
Many saw this debacle coming 3 years ago. Many others did not. No one saw the tourny title last year, but that was a fluke. A big fluke nestled between years of below-mediocrity performance.
Harrick has nothing to do with this. Felton has shown us what he can do and it's not cutting it.
Time to move on and start anew.
But Apparently Felton is comfortable enough in the progress of his program and his status as coach to jet off to the inauguration immediately following yesterday's latest blowout loss.
Un-fricking-believable.
Admittedly, I don't follow hoops the way I follow Georgia football, but I know enough about the talent level in the state of Georgia (city of Atlanta) that there is NO REASON we shouldn't be competing for titles every single year.
With the talent we should be drawing to Athens, last year's SEC tourney win should have been one of many. Of all our athletic programs up there, hoops is by far the most embarrassing. Either cut it loose altogether (is there any way we make any money off that thing?), or man up and start competing for titles.
Is men's basketball the only athletic program we have up there that doesn't have a realistic shot at a championship every year (aside from maybe track and field?)
If so, something needs to be done. Don't let it drag the whole place down, and do something with it.
Ben
Ben
The program generates a 1 million dollar profit currently. With solid ticket sales it could go 3 mil profit pretty easy
Hobnail,
Thx for the links!
Pwd
Reading back I see that my post is a little incoherent and a bit knee-jerk. Thanks for the numbers, PWD. Nonetheless, it should be a cash cow.
Ben
I don't think we should fire mid-season. Other than the 'tackiness' factor, I think it would allow UGA a reason to just promote an assistant to HC if he wins a few games (improving from Felton won't be hard). We need to clean house. Also, Felton deserves to be given the full year. While not the best coach, he has always been straight laced and has run a tight ship, you don't embarrass a coach who's done that for you after what Harrick did.
At the end of the year we're going to spend a TON of money to lure a good coach. I don't think we should go the proven mid-major route anymore, but rather pay some young guy (too bad we won't get Pelphry) a lot to come here. We've got/will have the facilities, we'll pay the money, you (new HC) get the opportunity to play in the SEC (lots of TV exposure, especially with new ESPN contract) and constantly battle big teams in big games.
One big name I want to see approached is Mark Few. He's run his course with Gonzaga, and this would give him an opportunity to join a powerhouse conference. I doubt he'll leave, but I think he's worth approaching. Either way I think we need someone young and passionate to turn this around, not an old 'name.'
Let's just put this all in perspective. We could all go out in a game of HORSE and shoot 10% from the 3-point line. That is terrible absolutely terrible.
We have no offense and Felton has come to accept it. The talent is there... the scheme, execution, and effort are not. He even said on his weekly show with Chuck Dowdle that he doesn't really care if we play well offensively as long as we do defensively. That sounds like accepting mediocrity to me.
How do y'all feel if we brought back Tubby? He would be great and shouldn't leave because he has gotten his "dream school" done with and should stay at UGA till he retires.
Mark Bradley mentioned Brian Gregory at Dayton. Not sure if he is what we need. Tried to get some information on him and got this:
http://blackburnreview.blogspot.com
What do you think? Gregory, Anthony Grant, etc? Who should be get instead?
There's no better fit out there for our program than Lon Kruger as far as I'm concerned. He's been alarmingly consistent in his stops at K-State, UF (where he built the foundation for Donovan), and Illinois (where he built what Bill Self inherited)in putting teams in contention for league titles and getting them into the tournament on a regular basis, even taking UF to the Final Four. He's not a high energy guy, a la Bruce Pearl, but I don't think we need some contrived injection of energy nearly as much as we need a sound technician who will run a clean program that we can all be proud of. UGA fans don't lack for enthusiasm when they've got a product worth cheering for.
I hate having to type this.After watching the UK it is obvious the kids have quit.Evans knew the rt. thing to do but refuses(R)being the only reason one can figure.CMR has saved Evans.DO the rt. thing and DROP bb at UGA.LANDERS is done ,the men had a couple yrs. under Tubby that has been long ago.UGA has no one with the"stones" to fix it.UGA should be ashmed to charge for that, let alone let it continue.
I guess we can't brag on the Harrick era.It was more fun than this.
Tubby- would you like some revenge against UK?
Can we get Tubby back?
I rather have a crappy team than the heartbreak w/ Harrick again.
My only issue with the mid-season firing is that is casts a more negative light on the program than a typical end of season removal.
After the Harrick debacle put the program into crisis and made it a national sports scandal I think we need as conventional of a removal as we can possibly get.
Would love to call Stegeman "The Tub" again ;)
RidgeDawg
GeorgiaBulldog.com
Who are these people who keep saying to drop men's basketball???? What planet are you from? If you think that would make more money for football, you are DEAD WRONG. Basketball is exceedingly profitable because of its low overhead--just think about that compared to football--and the excess money no doubt helps pay Martinez's salary, among other football-related expenses.
But mostly, where on earth have you misplaced your pride? Our team sucks for a while and you want to throw in the towel??? Really?
Given the monumental in-state recruiting base, the lack of dominant powers in a power conference--which would mean more recruiting riches all over the south--and the amount of money we have, I don't see why we can't get a really good up and comer or established coach. I mean, Memphis got Calipari, Pitt has Jamie Dixon, Tennessee has Pearl, Texas got Barnes from Clemson. What the hell did they have that we don't?
There are lots of solid programs but very few Kentuckys, UNCs, Dukes, Kansases, and UCLAs. I may have just listed them all.
Fire Felton now.
it's gotta be done.
RBUBP you answered your own question, they had an AD who worked to find them.Damon hasn't shown he can.UGA refuses to hire these type coaches.I doubt FB needs more money but baseball, gymnastics etc. might use it.I guess the other option is call coach Durham at least he saw a final 4.Since then the basketball teams are remembered for T. cole and the HARRICKS.The talent goes elsewhere for a reason.Those at Steg.againts cats cannot be proud of that "product".
Couple of things....
when has Damon proved he wouldn't hire those type coaches?
Secondly, I believe our SEC agreement requires us to have a basketball team.
Anon 7:54,
Yes, Evans was hired in 2004, afer Felton and Dooley. It's the Grand Genius Vince Dooley who hired Goof, Jirsa, Donnan, Richt, and Felton. He tried to hire Glen Mason, and we see how that turned out. I'm not sure if he hired Hugh Durham, but we all know the Harrick story.
I think he got lucky with Richt, and as an AD I have a hard time respecting someone who presided over such huge scandals as the Kemp, Cedric Henderson, and Harrick issues. Evans doesn't have a high bar to clear, and as far as I'm concerned, so far he's an improvement.
Forgot Vince hired Tubby too, so 2 of his last 4 were good.
Yeah lets drop basketball. That's a great idea! Especially after we just dropped $30 million on a new practice facility! Sheesh the internet sure does make everyone a drama queen.
rbubp: You can't possibly blame Dooley for Harrick. He was joined at the hip with Adams. It's too bad we can't have Felton's ethics and Harrick's coaching in one.
I agree all is fine give felton a 25 yr. deal a lifetime contract for evans.Heck fire CWM everything else is his fault. Then hush and wait til FB season.My bet is people think evans won't hire those because Ga. has the worst bb coach in the country.look at the stats or better still watch a game live.We all know why felton is still there and it is a very ugly reason.That 30 mil should have included a coach otherwise is just a building.
Anon 8:42, I agree in that I wasn't actually trying to blame Dooley for Harrick's hiring (although I didn't write it very well). I absolutely blame Dooley, along with Harrick, for the scandal, though. It's the AD's JOB not to let crap like that go by under his nose.
But Dooley never took any blame for the illegal players in the '82 Sugar Bowl, either, or any of the Kemp stuff.
Get a president fired, keep your job and popularity! He had a very "teflon" career in that regard.
Willie Martinez to leave UGA...
http://www.miamiherald.com/sports/colleges/um/story/861732.html
Yeah.
If, if, if, then maybe.
Bring in Bobby Knight. He said he would be interested in coaching again. Fill the seats, recruting boost, motivate players...........if not, choke'em out! We could use a little excitement and sense of urgency a chair throwing would bring about!
First off, if anyone really thinks Martinez is going to leave now after Mark Richt has literally stuck up for him through these last couple of years are kidding themselves. The guy does have a loyalty to Coach Richt. Plus, Miami is not even a stable job considering that if Shannon does have a better season next year he might be out of a job. And for people who want him gone, their are kids who actually want to play for him and Coach Richt like Branden Smith. Lets get this class in school then let Martinez prove himself because this is his last shot to be honest to turn it around or more than likely something will be done. He just got a raise and will not be going anywhere. Now back to the original topic, yes...Felton needs to go. Its not rocket science. His offensive packages have never impressed me. His recruiting has basically been bringing in low 3 star players and turning them into pretty good players. The ones that he did have that were rated pretty highly screwed up their own chances. Our best player is the highest rated guy he has ever brought in here which is Thompkins. We could replace him with an established coach because its not like UGA doesn't have the money. Hopefully, this will all get sorted out.
Please stop with the Tubby talk. Has everyone forgotten his parting gift to UGA when he left..... It was his recommendation that we keep Ron Jirsa. I will never forgive him for that.
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